by tpetrina on 10/24/24, 11:22 AM with 12 comments
Simply put: you don't trust their experience in general and you don't trust that their input for this project is relevant. On top of it, it is fluffy and boils down to "make better code". As if anyone consciously wants to make bad code.
If they are setting the stage for technical decisions, but you simply do not trust them, is this something that can be improved upon? Or you just switch companies. How to "disagree and commit" in that case? How to appeal to their managers or someone else? What if the manager above sees no issue with such people?
by fuzzfactor on 10/24/24, 12:46 PM
OTOH it can also be challenging when it's not higher on the organization chart.
These are two different conditions, but either way one good approach might be not to functionally work with them if it's not productive for you.
You can often work around a bozo wherever you find it.
Even if it can't last forever, if you are a very trustworthy and productive employee the time spent can still contribute to a career which is strongest on those desirable features. If you end up having nothing else to show for it, that would still be things that not everybody has.
The thing you have to really curtail is the natural tendency to intimidate the less-technically qualified, and especially the less-suitable-for-leadership operators above you on the ladder.
And whether or not you would really want to climb the ladder at that exact org is the thing to often reconsider the whole time you are there.
A lot of times if you want to move up, or simply not have to "work around" slugs, the only way might be to migrate toward a different company having a noticeably more trustworthy chain-of-command. Where your own productivity and trustworthiness can flourish without undue roadblocks, speed bumps, and potholes to navigate.
You may need to virtually imagine what it would be like if proper decisions were being made, each time a bozo drops the ball, to get a good idea if you are still making as much progress as you would prefer to do.
Edit:
>What if the manager above sees no issue with such people?
In an org where technical ability is not much of a defining characteristic in the chain-of-command, the manager above can not move ahead until he has a report who fits that mold to move up and fill his own position. That's your bozo and some of the privileges & incentives they have for being that way.
by jf22 on 10/25/24, 3:50 PM
Focus on what you can control and ignore the rest.
Based on the list of people you "don't respect" I'd ask yourself if you're perception of your own ability could be part of the problem.
by usgroup on 10/28/24, 8:25 AM
A more general strategy would be to realise what you can do is conditional on the world as it is, and try to make the best of that, improving incrementally as the opportunities arise. But this of course curtails a mind that is trying to produce the best its capacities will allow it.
I think that "making the best of it" is what most of "us" end up doing by the time we are in our 40s, and I would conjecture that here on HN you will find far more beautiful flowers that never blossomed than those that took their full bloom, for much the same reasons you mentioned, and the adaptions given above.
by dakiol on 10/25/24, 7:20 AM
Good salary and remote work is worth it.
by giantg2 on 10/24/24, 5:57 PM
Other than that, just have a backup plan for an exit.
by Spooky23 on 10/24/24, 3:10 PM
by revskill on 10/26/24, 3:51 PM
The hardest part, is the base knowledge is different , both from theoretical and empirical knowledge.
by ariosto on 10/25/24, 6:28 PM
by tacostakohashi on 10/25/24, 12:24 PM
You don't have to agree, just nod your head and smile politely. You can still do your own thing. You can ask for data, working examples, evidence, proof of concept to substantiate any wild claims. You can politely say, "that's a great idea, _you_ should do that!" or "I don't think I'm the right person to execute your vision here, but I hope you find someone."
Remember that they're probably well-intentioned, and acting in good faith. Trust them... to advocate for their own interests and priorities, which may be different from yours, which you'll have to find ways to advocate for yourself.
by hidden_sheepman on 10/25/24, 12:42 PM
by purple-leafy on 10/25/24, 8:05 PM
Had a thick-as-dogshit “product owner” with absolutely no technical skills, no vision, just fucking clueless and arrogant.
I cared and tried to make “good decisions” but they sabotaged the project. Then they scapegoated me to leadership when the project was dogwater.
by bravetraveler on 10/25/24, 11:40 AM