from Hacker News

Verizon is Selling Your Personal Data

by morewillie on 10/9/12, 8:05 PM with 125 comments

• by dude_abides on 10/9/12, 8:25 PM

  Thanks for the PSA.

  While I understand why these things tend to be opt-out by default, I'm surprised there was no email from Verizon updating users about these new settings with a link to opt-out if they wanted to.

  I used to think that the telecom industry is a lot more regulated than social network companies like Facebook, but I guess that's not really true!

• by chintan on 10/9/12, 8:46 PM

  Offtopic: This is the first time I'm seeing a post "on" app.net and not "about" app.net

• by evoxed on 10/9/12, 8:28 PM

  Just so everyone knows, AT&T does the same thing. You have 30 days from the date of your contract before they start passing it out, but I believe you can opt out of future transactions on the site. Try going to http://att.com/ecpnioptout (if you got a new contract with your iPhone 5, do it this week!)

  Edit: I should say, AT&T does something similar. I do not know if it is the same thing, since their opt-out page makes it sound rather innocuous compared to the vague language used in the mailed letter. CPNI = Customer Proprietary Network Information

• by roryokane on 10/9/12, 9:20 PM

  These are the steps to opt out of Verizon “selling your personal data”, as far as I can tell:

  Visit http://www.vzw.com/myprivacy. If you are not already signed in to My Verizon, you will be prompted to sign in – after doing so, return to that myprivacy page.

  Click the link “Manage Location Privacy settings” near the bottom, which points to https://locationmanagement.vzw.com/

  You should now be at “Location Management” > “Location Privacy Settings”. I’m guessing that this is where you actually opt-out. I’m not sure because there’s nothing for me to do here – I see “There are no services available. A location service must be downloaded on the handset to be listed here.”.

• by rkudeshi on 10/9/12, 9:14 PM

  A related story: I was recently shopping around for a new ISP. One I considered was Verizon FiOS. In order to see the prices in my area, I had to enter my address.

  Two weeks later, I got a letter in the mail. Written outside on the envelope was something like: "We noticed you were checking out our website! Here's a special offer just for you..."

  It's not the same as what OP posted, but it certainly left me creeped out.

• by trotsky on 10/10/12, 12:49 PM

  given the increasing ubiquity of these kinds of deals and the quixotic whack-a-mole game they call opt outs, how dumb would it be to cut out the middle men and just say "hey, for the low price of whatever you're paying now we'll all just sell you our habits, cookies, weblogs, location data, brand preferences and shopping habits (via some up front mobile aggregator of said data). It seems likely that people spend enough collectively tracking and profiling me that it might pay for a night out a month if we cut out the middle men. And hell, it might even have an unexpected bonus - the law of the jungle say if it runs chase it and if it chases you, run. Maybe you'd stop being desired tracking target in the end :)

• by kmfrk on 10/9/12, 8:59 PM

  What the hell is it with you Americans and your abhorrent carriers?

• by rwolf on 10/9/12, 10:30 PM

  No requests are sent when I hit the "Save Changes" button. I have a small amount of confidence that my preferences are going to be picked up.

• by acheron on 10/9/12, 9:32 PM

  "Verizon" and "Verizon Wireless" are separate companies. It looks like this refers to Verizon Wireless: e.g., if you have Verizon service for phone, FIOS, or whatever, you are unaffected.

  Well, they're probably still selling your personal data, but not in this specific instance.

• by wkdown on 10/9/12, 8:28 PM

  > EVERYONE is selling your personal data.

  FTFY

• by biturd on 10/9/12, 9:54 PM

  Will using https prevent them from doing this? I imagine it would stop data gathering and referrer gathering but the source URL request they would still be able to see?

  A VPN would be the only option to keeping them completely blind? I can set up a VPN on an Amazon micro instance for free. The amount of data used should be nothing or mere pennies per month to Amazon.

  The only trouble is keeping a VPN up. I find on an iPhone at least that while once working, it works reliably, but keeping it working is unreliable. It seems when you transition from one network to another, one wifi to another, one cell tower to smother, or from wifi to cell and vice versa, the connection can often drop.

  I wish there was a setting like "auto connect VPN when any data request is made".

  I've tried VPN's from Amazon of my own creation as well as the VPN included with my GigaNews account.

  I'm sure running the VPN on your mobile is great for battery life.

• by overbroad on 10/9/12, 10:10 PM

  Maybe opting out is not how to stop this abhorrent practice of selling personal information. There is much more at stake than sites just selling email address lists. There is much more detailed information involved.

  Perhaps what would work better is flooding these marketers with false information. This is what hampers email lists. Most the addresses do not work.

  As it stands the few (or many) people who fail to "opt-out" (or fail to use proxies) may make this sort of personal information sales market worthwhile because the information gathered is detailed and reasonably accurate. It's not just a list of disposable email addresses. It's higher quality.

• by benburleson on 10/9/12, 9:18 PM

  Using Chrome the buttons to save changes were not functioning.

  For each section, select the option you want, then in console run chgCPNI(); or chgReports(); or chgAds(); depending on which section you changed.

• by kqr2 on 10/9/12, 8:40 PM

  Also, check out how long Verizon stores your data:

  http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2011/09/cellular-customer-d...

• by hammock on 10/9/12, 9:19 PM

  Where can I buy this data?

• by njloof on 10/9/12, 8:30 PM

  Tried to change settings and got an error. Quelle surprise.

• by mcguire on 10/10/12, 4:54 PM

  "Your privacy is an important priority at Verizon Wireless."

  From the Verizon customer privacy settings page.

• by unfletch on 10/9/12, 11:54 PM

  Does anyone know if this applies to iPad-only customers? That's my only Verizon account, but the opt-out link requires a phone number to log in. (Ditto for the "forgot user id" form.)

• by knighthacker on 10/9/12, 8:22 PM

  wow. At least they gave you the option to opt-out haha :)

• by cr4zy on 10/10/12, 4:23 AM

  Here's the text you see when you log in, if you don't have Verizon. When trying to opt-out, I get an error.

  -------------------------------------------------------

  Your privacy is an important priority at Verizon Wireless. Our Privacy Policy informs you about information we collect and how we use it. Read our Privacy Policy.

  Location Based Services ("LBS") Privacy Settings A location service is any service that provides access to location information, such as maps of places of interest and turn-by-turn directions, on your handset. These services may require Verizon Wireless to access the location of your handset. For location services you use that are supported by Verizon Wireless, you can Manage Location Privacy settings.

  Customer Proprietary Network Information Settings As a provider of certain telecommunications services, Verizon Wireless collects certain information that is made available to us solely by virtue of our relationship with you, such as quantity, technical configuration, type, destination, location and amount of use of the telecommunications services you purchase. This information and related billing information is known as Customer Proprietary Network Information (CPNI). The Federal Communications Commission and other regulators require the Verizon Companies to protect your CPNI.

  Verizon Wireless shares information among our affiliates and parent companies (including Vodafone) and their subsidiaries unless you advise us not to. Sharing this information allows us to provide you with the latest information about our products and services and to offer you our latest promotions.

  Settings Don't Share My CPNI OK to Share My CPNI

  Business & Marketing Reports Verizon Wireless may use mobile usage information and consumer Information for certain business and marketing reports. Mobile usage information includes the addresses or information in URLs (such as search terms) of websites you visit when you use our wireless service, the location of your device ("Location Information"), and your use of applications and features. Consumer information includes information about your use of Verizon products and services (such as data and calling features,device type, and amount of use) as well as demographic and interest categories provided to us by other companies (such as gender, age range, sports fan, frequent diner, or pet owner). We will combine this information in a manner that does not personally identify you. We will use this information to prepare business and marketing reports that we may use ourselves or share with others. We may also share Location Information with other companies in a way that does not personally identify you. We will allow these companies to produce limited business and marketing reports. See our Frequently Asked Questions for more information about these reports.

  You have a choice about whether we use your information for these reports.

  Settings Don't use my information for aggregate reports OK to use my information for aggregate reports

• by lockes5hadow on 10/10/12, 4:13 AM

  What is really strange to me is the page is different in firefox and chrome (3 options vs 2), the chrome page doesn't work, and if you turn off everything in firefox, then reload the page in chrome, chrome shows them still all being on.

• by danilocampos on 10/9/12, 9:05 PM

  Unrelated, but having had to log in, I'm now reminded of a VZW security issue:

  Can someone explain the doubtless backward and sloppy thinking that would convince Verizon that they should forbid their users from including symbols in their passwords?

• by bicknergseng on 10/9/12, 8:56 PM

  So do banks... other telecoms... Facebook... Google... etc.

• by gdi2290 on 10/10/12, 10:39 AM

  Verizon sent me a letter about this a couple of years ago that's when I told everyone I knew with Verizon to opt out of it before they implement it

• by monsur on 10/10/12, 3:55 AM

  Verizon is not the only one who does this. I've seen the same from AT&T and Chase. I'm sure the list of companies that do this is very long.

• by bcl on 10/10/12, 12:52 AM

  I haven't received an email and when I logged and checked the settings on my account I was already opted out.

• by guscost on 10/9/12, 10:35 PM

  Well that sucks, doesn't it?

• by white_devil on 10/10/12, 9:31 AM

  Newsflash: Everyone who possibly can is selling your personal data.

• by Cieplak on 10/9/12, 10:41 PM

  I wonder if they are doing the same for their FiOS customers.

• by jawr on 10/9/12, 9:26 PM

  Who isn't these days?

• by sempergumbi on 10/10/12, 1:16 AM

  I called Verizon and they said this is a phishing scam... Has anyone else independently verified the original claim with Verizon, other than through their website/privacy TOS?

• by Evbn on 10/10/12, 4:05 AM

  Selling data, or exploiting to sell ads?

  Neither Google nor Facebook sell user data, they hold it close and sell ads against it.

• by lucian303 on 10/10/12, 5:42 AM

  The question is not what Verizon is doing but what is Verizon _not_ doing? The answer will be much shorter.

• by drivebyacct2 on 10/9/12, 11:33 PM

  This is very, very old news.