by miles on 6/20/25, 11:46 PM with 184 comments
by hedora on 6/21/25, 1:54 PM
A more concerning issue is the nature of the bags being thrown away. California banned “single use” plastic bags (which we used to reuse as trash bags for the bathroom or whatever) but lets you buy “reusable” ones for a few cents at the checkout counter. The reusable ones are much heavier and contain 10-100x more plastic, and take even longer to biodegrade.
The study counts “items”, not weight, and reports a 25-47% decrease.
Assuming California is the region that hit 47% (call it 50%), and the reusable bags are better than the best available (only 10x worse than pre-ban) that translates to a 5x increase in microplastics on the beach. I’d consider this a disaster, not a win.
This matches older studies, which measured total plastic content of landfill waste before and after plastic bag bans like California’s.
Those showed sharp increases in plastic waste too. The studies in question were in places that did not allow the reusable plastic ones that California forced the stores to switch to. Instead, the authors found that people switched from using the disposable bags as trash bags to using kitchen trash bags, which are ~100x worse. If only 1% of households were using disposable shopping bags for trash, and no one reused the new style bags, then the policies ended up breaking even. In practice, the policies increased total plastic waste, despite being better thought out than California’s newer ban.
I’m all for banning plastic bags, but the current bans target the most efficient use of plastic, increasing overall plastic production and waste. The bans should only target things that have plastic-free alternatives, or at least that have less plastic intensive alternatives.
by ofalkaed on 6/21/25, 9:53 AM
The garbage bags and plastic bag that wash up on the beach are insignificant compared to the garbage beach goers leave on the beach and people who don't live on the beach don't realize how much garbage that is because those of us who do live on the beach spoil our morning stroll and swim with picking up the garbage so the beach can be clean and ready to be spoiled all over again.
by thinkingemote on 6/21/25, 11:23 AM
https://www.mcsuk.org/ocean-emergency/ocean-pollution/plasti...
by mykowebhn on 6/21/25, 8:13 AM
I comment like this because I understand that the struggle is not only to stop this kind of waste--and on a larger scale the environmental destruction of our planet--but also to engage and motivate the public at large to want to make these changes.
by keybored on 6/21/25, 9:10 AM
Yeah why? Because you get the choice to take a plastic bag with you or not at the checkout. That’s why. That’s you choice. You have much less (just indirect) choice when it comes to how much plastic the stuff you buy is wrapped in. But wait. That’s a lot of it. Even most apparently cardboard wrapping makes me second guess if there is a microfilm of plastic over it.
So we have to hyperfocus on this type of plastic. The one that is the consumer’s choice. And plastic straws of course.
Even less of a choice is commercial fishing equipment being dumped in the ocean. Or things being dumped from other commercial activities.
They got data from citizen-scientists from plastic cleanup. Were those volunteers?[1] If so, plastic pollution propaganda is so important that the important work of plastic cleanup is given to concerned citizens as a bleeding heart hazing ritual. Is that how serious we are about the issue?
The nearest small sports arena is made of synthetic grass which is pellets of plastic. But that’s fine. Plastic bags.
[1] Or that might just be a stereotype by me
by cubefox on 6/21/25, 6:52 PM
by drakonka on 6/21/25, 4:03 PM
by Padriac on 6/21/25, 10:04 PM
by crtified on 6/21/25, 11:49 PM
by culebron21 on 6/21/25, 9:40 AM
And straws, oh yes. I noticed after covid they're in individual packaging!
by unlimit on 6/21/25, 8:57 AM
by Padriac on 6/21/25, 10:10 PM
by yboris on 6/21/25, 3:55 PM
by eth0up on 6/21/25, 11:04 PM
I found it a feeble but amiable concept. I'd not be disappointed if my state adopted the practice.
I've always been awkwardly before my time, and seldom redeemed. As a teen, I vituperated against recycling, suggesting a drastic overhaul of the system altogether, for high frequency low volume consumer product containers. Milk, big gulps, H2O, rice, whatever -- it should all be purchased through brilliantly designed, stalwartly sanitary vending systems in a world where we have heirloom water bottles and shopping bags from granpa, made to last and used for ages.
That hasn't happened.
I do my part though. This includes occasional confrontation. One example is what I've coined the Beer Birka.
I sometimes purchase a single beer. While the degree of fervor on the clerk's behalf varies from indifferent to mortal combat, there is a bizarre assumption that the beer must enter a bag, for if not, some unspoken terror is imminent. In some cases, depending on the jurisdiction and endemic insanity thereof, the beverage must accordingly be veiled. In other territories, it's optional, but questioning is discouraged.
There have been many occasions where I exerted eloquent dissent and rational resistance. Again, depending on the coordinates of terrain, reactions range from politely insistent to bellicose.
I often remark that I'll accept the bag, just to spare the beverage from the inevitable beating implied, which would almost certainly affect the opening ritual upon arriving home, suds on the countertop and so on. Lost beer.
I'm not a nudist, but most tinned products shouldn't excite a healthy person to the point of violence or moral crisis.
And for fucks sake, there's a sufficient amount of plastic out there already. So why crusade for more? Just relax, and let people buy shit without invoking unsolicited waste. Back off, you deranged bastards! I'll take the bag and deposit it in back of the facility for you to retrieve after work. I'm willing to compromise.
The petroplasticidal matryoshka paradigm extrudes far beyond though. Anyone east of the Mississippi has been asked, indirectly or point blank," do you want a bag for your bag, sir/ma'am?”.
I often accept, because the difference between their religious artifact and the dwindling roll under my sink permits approximately equal utility, and so, a pile of dog shit or something else fits in just fine, for free.
by b0a04gl on 6/21/25, 2:20 PM
by userbinator on 6/21/25, 8:35 AM
by jekwoooooe on 6/21/25, 4:05 PM