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George Orwell's 1984 and How Power Manufactures Truth

by colinprince on 6/17/25, 12:33 AM with 86 comments

  • by z2 on 6/17/25, 1:01 AM

    I'm reminded of this famous quote from the Nuremberg Diary, and the casualness of how it seems to have been stated:

    Göring: Why, of course, the people don't want war. Why would some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best that he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece? Naturally, the common people don't want war; neither in Russia, nor in England, nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship.

    Gilbert: There is one difference. In a democracy the people have some say in the matter through their elected representatives, and in the United States only Congress can declare wars.

    Göring: Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuremberg_Diary

  • by mc32 on 6/17/25, 12:57 AM

    It’s absolutely sad and heavily ironic that this book now gets slapped with trigger warnings[1] What in hell has happened to people?

    How in hell is any adult supposed to read any book of consequence if routine things trigger them? Moreso for such an iconic book that criticizes crass authoritarianism.

    [1]https://uk.news.yahoo.com/putting-trigger-warnings-george-or...

  • by Gathering6678 on 6/17/25, 1:17 AM

    I feel like there are different kinds of "truth": some of them easier than others to be manufactured, e.g. easier to manufacture hatred and war than peace (unless the country is already deep in it and not winning)?

  • by tho23iwlefdsfd on 6/17/25, 1:01 AM

    A disclaimer: this "political" nature of everything is deeply baked into Western culture, going all the way back to pre-Xtian 'Western' (~ non-Indian) religion.

    Things are a lot more subtlety in broadly "Indosphere" (or atleast its old version before all the rampage of Islam and Western colonization).

  • by chiefalchemist on 6/17/25, 1:14 AM

    Truth is a function of Trust. The more you trust the source the greater the risk of being manipulated; especially under the influence of confirmation bias; of course there’s also repetition.

  • by farts_mckensy on 6/17/25, 1:58 AM

    The idea that "power manufactures truth" sounds profound but it's ultimately a truism, and a somewhat unhelpful one due to the imprecise language of power and truth. Anyone who's worked at a small business with an authoritarian owner can attest to the distortion effect of authority. People trip over themselves to ensure such a personality remains placated. But truth, in any meaningful sense of the word, is something beyond the grasp of any single authority. Powerful elites may have sway over the narrative, but eventually the truth catches up with them, and that's when history starts moving again. The 2008 recession is a great example. Most financial authorities maintained that real estate was solid. Orwell's vision vastly oversells the true power of authoritarian states. At the end of the day, if you cannot keep a baseline number of the population satisfied, they will rebel in ways that will eventually undermine the status quo. It may not take the form of a full blown civil war, but people have a way of expressing their interests. For example, the birth rate is dropping in many countries. Increasingly, people do not see having children as viable. And for good reason. That undermines the present society. The upper classes need a working class to maintain their position.

  • by vjvjvjvjghv on 6/17/25, 1:04 AM

    I find it a little disappointing that they are reducing it to Trump. The left has its own version of “Newspeak” thanks to political correctness and DEI efforts. I guess in the end people in power or who want to get in power will promote vocabularies that support their cause and discourage use of words that don’t support them.

    I feel more and more we are slowly moving into a future between 1984 and Brave New World.

  • by thrance on 6/17/25, 12:54 PM

    Insane how many people, even in this thread, are seeing the president sending the fucking army against US citizens and going "no bro, 1984 is when woke and DEI". America is done, and it's well deserved.

  • by rustcleaner on 6/17/25, 4:05 AM

    Power manufactures 'truth' [memes] because the source of power is everybody's collective actions, and that has to be farmed in various ways through a consent manufacturing process. Change what people believe and you change their actions. Change their actions and you change the nature of the beast-machine they form, upon which oligarchy attempts to ride. Magick goes much deeper than parlor tricks of optics, or spooky hocuspocus spiritual bullshit. It is in use everyday by various institutions, and most who use magick don't even realize it.

    Examples:

    -The beliefs you hold about the world and others, much which was shaped by childhood media;

    -When Bush tells you Iraq has WMDs;

    -When the car commercial comes on, showing you a scenic vista and for a moment you forget yourself;

    -When you believe X, but the commenters in article comment sections sway the opposite (bots);

    to name a small handful. Sounds too far fetched?

    Here is the machine magicians program for:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wo_e0EvEZn8

    Do you see the zone in this machine, where magick can exist? It's the zone where you experience #FF00FF as magenta (if you're not colorblind). People really see what they expect to see, not what is there in front of them unless they really spend some effort!

    What do they want to see? They want to see what you set them up to want to see.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykzkvK1XaTE