by hebejebelus on 8/6/12, 6:43 AM with 75 comments
by noonespecial on 8/6/12, 7:58 AM
Space is different than our other frontiers because as a proportion of its size to ours, its unprecedented. It belongs to everyone who wants to go, and will for a very long time.
"take my love, take my land, take me where I cannot stand, I don't care, I'm still free, you can't take the sky from me"
by SCdF on 8/6/12, 7:09 AM
It belongs to the people who actually goddamn contributed to the project. The people who coded it, who built it, who put in the hard effort. Yes, American people funded it, via taxes, but they didn't actually pick to fund it, their government decided it was a good idea. A random person in the states flipping burgers is no more responsible for NASA's achievements than someone flipping burgers in France, or in China, or in Ireland.
I don't say this to be negative, or to put a downer on this fantastic event: I was watching the live-stream with my heart in my mouth, and it's an amazing achievement.
But, if we're going to bring this kind of thing up, I felt like I might as well voice my criticism of this 'couch-achieving' that seems to be to popular.
My country (NZ) currently has the most gold medals in the Olympics of any nation on Earth... provided to measure them per capita. Some people are proud of this achievement. That's fair, you could argue that some of a countries success in the games are based around the logistics of simply sourcing good people, and so the more people you have the better your chances. What doesn't make sense is when people I know talk as if they themselves achieved something.
Sorry if this is a rant, but I really wish people would just be proud of whgat they themselves have achieved, and be proud of other people when they achieve great things, instead of trying to live through other people.
by GuiA on 8/6/12, 6:54 AM
I disagree. Space is there, and it's fine for us to explore it (although space garbage is an issue), but claiming it is just typical human pettiness.
by fakelvis on 8/6/12, 8:03 AM
Not everyone working on past, current and future Mars Exploration Programs is an American citizen. The funding may be from the U.S., but the individual contributions at NASA come from all over the world.
To name just three, there's Fernando Abilleira, Spain (trajectory analyst); Nathalie Cabrol, France (planetary geologist); and Firouz Naderi, Iran (manager of the Mars Exploration Program). There's a huge list of people, you should check it out: http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/programmissions/people/
by redwood on 8/6/12, 6:56 AM
by hnriot on 8/6/12, 6:55 AM
And I'm not even an American. I will be just as happy next time any other nation does something like this too, but this one belongs to the Americans.
by elorant on 8/6/12, 7:08 AM
by shrikant on 8/6/12, 11:26 AM
It was initially promulgated by the USA, UK and [then] USSR in 1967, a 100 countries are currently party to it (with a further 26 signatories pending ratification], and it explicitly says, "outer space, including the Moon and other celestial bodies, is not subject to national appropriation by claim of sovereignty, by means of use or occupation, or by any other means".
All this is under the ambit of the United Nations Office for Outer Space Affairs.
Personally, the cynic in me can't help but believe that the USA was an eager initial party to this because they were terrified that the Soviet Union would pip them to the Moon-post.
[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outer_Space_Treaty
[2] http://www.oosa.unvienna.org/oosa/SpaceLaw/outerspt.html
by ChrisNorstrom on 8/6/12, 8:25 AM
Examples:
1) I also do volunteer environmental cleanup. So far I've bagged 523 pounds of garbage from forested areas and some abandoned private properties. Garbage pollution happens in forested areas and land where neither party knows exactly who owns what. Land without ownership is allowed to accumulate garbage which flows into the storm drains, into the rivers, and into the oceans. Without ownership, one cannot be accountable. Without ownership there can be no consequences or rule of law. People don't take care of things they don't own (or realize they own).
2) Many African countries are still on the "communal lands" system. Where no one owns any land and individuals simply have a right to live on it. This lack of land rights and ownership is one of the main reasons why so many Africans live in poverty, are behind, cannot build wealth, and resulted in the 2010 Great African Land Grab. Fertile Land the size of France was taken away from numerous African nations at only 23 cents per hectare. That's 23 cents. The normal rate can be $1,000 per hectare. Natives are forced off the land by force.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/global-development/poverty-matters...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y05fzp0YSrw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxFTGq94dXs
http://www.oaklandinstitute.org/special-investigation-two-la...
by jcnnghm on 8/6/12, 6:48 AM
Editing in more details from posts I've made before:
The total 2010 US Space budget was $64.6B. The entire rest of the world combined spent only $22.5B. NASA's 2010 budget was $18.7B, 83% of the spending for the rest of the world. The entire ESA budget is a paltry $4.6B, while the EU has a higher GDP than the US.
Not all US space spending is through NASA. For example, the GPS system is not included in NASA's budget, it's spearheaded by the Air Force Space Command, and comes out of the Defense budget. And before anyone says that Defense space spending should not be included, keep in mind that will dramatically reduce the overall global space budget which does include defense spending. For example, the European Galileo satellite navigation system, which has cost some €20B, is included in the ESA budget, so it would have to be taken out in order to compare with NASA, our civilian space program.
If the rest of the world spent as much as the United States on space exploration by GDP, global space spending would be 4.1 times higher than it is today. $267B instead of $87.1B.
by olalonde on 8/6/12, 7:06 AM
by beaker52 on 8/6/12, 9:32 AM
The illusion of ownership is a facet of much suffering of, and is caused by humans (and other sentient beings, for we are all animals) under the idea that they own things, collectively or individually. How can things external of a being be owned by it, when the being, as well as that it considers itself to own, are transient, impermanent and microscopic in the long game? Especially when we consider that this illusion causes suffering to ourselves (through loss) and others (through the opportunity to grasp that which is denied).
by rickdangerous1 on 8/6/12, 7:22 AM
by dbbolton on 8/6/12, 7:13 AM
This was one of the main themes in Lem's Solaris (ignore the subpar George Clooney knock-off). Really a great read for sci-fi fans.
by fosk on 8/6/12, 7:06 AM
PS: I'm not american.
by treelovinhippie on 8/6/12, 8:47 AM
What we need is an International space exploration program where countries can be involved provided they commit a certain percentage of their GDP.
by synor on 8/6/12, 12:24 PM
by dfc on 8/6/12, 7:04 AM
by dhechols on 8/6/12, 10:47 AM
by 37prime on 8/6/12, 7:08 AM
by startupfounder on 8/6/12, 12:48 PM
by rogerchucker on 8/6/12, 9:52 AM
by theorique on 8/6/12, 10:25 AM
In America, you own space.
In Soviet Russia, space own you!