from Hacker News

New York Times is targeting Wordle clones with DMCA takedowns

by mryall on 3/8/24, 8:28 PM with 107 comments

by mryall on 3/8/24, 8:31 PM
> In a statement to 404 Media, the Times said:
> > The Times has no issue with individuals creating similar word games that do not infringe The Times’s “Wordle” trademarks or copyrighted gameplay.
Can you really copyright “gameplay”?
This seems like pointless bullying by the Times, who is probably just upset they haven’t got a positive ROI on their acquisition of a free game.
by gnicholas on 3/8/24, 11:55 PM
> citing its ownership over the Wordle name and copyrighted gameplay including 5x6 tile layout and gray, yellow, and green color scheme.
So this is referring to trademark (the name Wordle) and copyright — but not patent. It makes sense to go after people who are using the same actual name, since this clearly infringes the trademark, and because if you do not enforce ("police") your mark against minor players, you can end up losing the ability to enforce it against major players.
But the copyright bit is a bit novel from my perspective (lawyer, but not copyright lawyer). If you had asked me what a copyright claim about Wordle would be about, I would have said the precise code. I might have wondered about the specific word lists, even though these would probably fail the "phone book" test (don't remember the case, but these were deemed uncopyrightable). I never would have thought about the tile layout and color scheme. That seems more like what I think of as "trade dress" [1] or perhaps something related to patent (which wouldn't apply here, unless the original Wordle owner had filed for patents a long time ago.
Are there any copyright lawyers who can elucidate how the tile layout and color scheme might be subject to copyright law? I assume the NYT has good lawyers, and has thought long and hard before going after folks on github...
1: https://www.inta.org/topics/trade-dress
by helsinkiandrew on 3/8/24, 9:42 PM
It’s interesting that they seem fine with blatently copying part of the BBC game show Only Connect for their Connections game:
https://www.reddit.com/r/onlyconnect/comments/169j2p4/have_y...
by a1o on 3/8/24, 8:50 PM
Mechanics can't be copyrighted (unless it's MTG tap mechanic, it seems), but what is weird is apparently the projects it went against were in different languages that Wordle doesn't cover (which I think matters considering Wordle is about guessing words) and using a different name.
by crtified on 3/8/24, 9:20 PM
The asset NYT bought when they bought Wordle, was to have their name indelibly associated with a trend that is more popular than they themselves are.
It is simply "our name in your face, on a regular basis, for years" advertising, at a global scale.
Case in point : here we all are, thinking and talking about the NYT.
That is the ROI.
by racingmars on 3/8/24, 8:44 PM
This feels like a trademark question, not a copyright question. Seems like an abuse of DMCA; if only it were easier to ensure companies filing fraudulent DMCA claims end up facing real consequences.
by dang on 3/8/24, 8:56 PM
Recent and related:
NY Times issues DMCA takedowns of Wordle clones - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39618193 - March 2024 (44 comments)
by fieryscribe on 3/8/24, 9:01 PM
It's interesting to see them go after others for copying gameplay when they have done exactly the same: https://www.theguardian.com/media/2023/jun/15/connections-ne...
by brikym on 3/9/24, 1:54 AM
Hey NYT I hope you’ll enjoy my game called QWERTL https://qwertl.com
Or my other game https://redactle.net which sounds ever so similar to wordle so you had better send your lawyers.
Or what about https://memorycardsgame.com - I mean it has a grid layout so surely that must be copyrighted too.
I will file any complaints into my computers /dev/null disk.
by marssaxman on 3/8/24, 8:45 PM
Well, that just makes me want to stop playing Wordle.
by kbf on 3/8/24, 9:38 PM
If you’re looking for a Wordle game they can’t take from you, Wordyl on Game Boy is one I’ve been enjoying :)
https://bbbbbr.itch.io/gb-wordyl
by anthk on 3/8/24, 9:10 PM
This is just Mastermind with words. I remember word puzzles like that in several newspapers and magazines across the world for -decades-.
In Spanish media it was usually called "Deducción".
Link in Spanish as proof:
http://pasatiemposmatematicosdelaprensa.blogspot.com/2013/10...
The last puzzle it's from 1999.
by anthk on 3/8/24, 9:05 PM
Lingo predates Wordle and I remember that show in my country more than 30 years ago.
by onemoresoop on 3/8/24, 9:09 PM
Does anyone know if anything like https://www.threemagicwords.app/ is going to receive a DMCA takedown? It is somewhat similar to Wordle and yet quite different.
by wly_cdgr on 3/8/24, 11:38 PM
GTFO NYT lol it is well established that gameplay mechanics are not subject to copyright. The level of presumption and disrespect and ignorance about the culture is pretty par for the course for the goons running the NYT.
by ashton314 on 3/8/24, 9:18 PM
If someone makes a FOSS version that can be easily dropped onto a public server somewhere, then we should all host a Wordle clone. (I'm sure the code has already been written a thousand times over…)
by mig39 on 3/9/24, 12:48 AM
No problem with the New York Times ripping off Only Connect though.
https://web.archive.org/web/20230709023951/https://www.teleg...
by ok123456 on 3/8/24, 10:32 PM
Doesn't the name "Wordle" and the rules for the game come from an article in Creative Computing in the 70s?
by mynameisnoone on 3/9/24, 5:22 AM
"The [self-congratulatory] paper of record" behaves as an arrogant, evil megacorp. Is this news? (Pun intended)
by MisterBastahrd on 3/8/24, 11:14 PM
Worldle is just hangman with hints.
by fddrdplktrew on 3/9/24, 1:26 AM
DMCA itself should be illegal
by camdenlock on 3/8/24, 10:13 PM
In the end, everyone’s just becoming a game company.
Er, sorry; an “experience” company.
by visarga on 3/8/24, 10:32 PM
Are NYT still writing news, or just copyright trolling?
by kepler1 on 3/8/24, 8:50 PM
A company wants to enforce its copyright, etc., fine. That's their right to do so. Although I beg to differ with our copyright laws.
No, what I find objectionable about the NYT games team, such as their spelling bee puzzle, is that they selectively deem certain words not valid responses. Not curse words or words with no redeeming value, but words that are perceived to be derogatory against disadvantaged groups or "offensive". It's like an extension of the hyper sensitive liberal newsroom.
Fine, it's a private organization and their choice. But it reflects in my mind a hijacking of the language by people oversensitized to the point of ridiculousness.