from Hacker News

St. John's woman loses home after Phoenix pay fiasco

by ovis on 6/29/22, 1:51 PM with 24 comments

  • by tartoran on 6/29/22, 2:29 PM

    Giant systems of immense complexity that nobody can understand, what could go wrong? And even if they’re a complete failure, they’ll never admit to it

  • by stewx on 6/29/22, 2:54 PM

    I read one expert describe the Phoenix pay system as "garbage in, garbage out". The government signed hundreds of separate collective bargaining agreements with public sector unions, each with their own different rules for pay, overtime, etc, making the system highly complex. Because of this complexity, the software handling it is full of bugs. Arguably it's partially a failure on the government's part not to negotiate a standard set of pay practices.

  • by yakak on 6/29/22, 3:07 PM

    I'm not sure why they aren't treating this as a possible embezzlement? It seems to me like anyone familiar with this system could take payments for someone apparently without tracking and the result would be clawed back from later paychecks. Who is to say if 200k illegitimate bank accounts are receiving transfers every month?

  • by dmix on 6/29/22, 2:34 PM

    It's been 5 years since she first got $0 paychecks and this still hasn't been resolved?

    I'm confused why the union or whoever can't sue the government on their behalf. Or some lawyer takes on a bunch of their cases if it's 200k people affected.

  • by shagie on 6/29/22, 3:41 PM

    Some other context on the system:

    Anger rising over failed Phoenix Pay system - https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1173674563714 (4 years ago)

    Former CRA auditor says even he ‘cannot fathom’ way out of Phoenix mess - https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/2039588419529

    Public servants express 'zero faith' in Phoenix damages claims process after long waits - https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/public-servant-phoenix...

    (topic) Phoenix Falling - https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/topic/Tag/Phoenix%20Falling

    Phoenix 'nightmare' still haunting public servants, more than 6 years on https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/phoenix-pay-system-iss...

    Ottawa spent $560-million on damages over the Phoenix pay system, records show https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-ottawa-paid...

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoenix_pay_system

    The Professional Institute of the Public Service of Canada - Phoenix Pay category - https://pipsc.ca/news-issues/phoenix-pay-system (lots of linked articles)

  • by redeeman on 6/29/22, 3:16 PM

    it seems to be a natural law that once a society takes the steps to create a government that "grants" rights to the citizens, the road to a hell is already paved. It is now inevitable that the government will see citizens as their property, and all justice is lost.

  • by spacemanmatt on 6/29/22, 2:22 PM

    IBM famously screwed up Texas' transit tag billing, too.

  • by thatguy0900 on 6/29/22, 2:12 PM

    I'm confused about why she stayed? It doesn't say she ever got any money back. I would be gone after the first 0$ check, why would you stay after that?

  • by 0xbadc0de5 on 6/29/22, 3:22 PM

    So the tax collector also screws over their own employees and not just taxpayers? Welcome to the club, I guess.