by dwmbt on 1/18/22, 8:44 PM with 44 comments
i feel ashamed. i don't think this is absent grief. i loved this person with my entire being. i'm worried that there's something wrong with me. is this my way of grieving? is my coping mechanism letting go of all sentiment and walking through the motions? i feel so out of place; they keep asking me if i'm okay; i'm thinking of putting on the act of being completely distraught so that everyone else will leave me alone. i'm so drained and i think it's mostly this anxiety over my reaction. i'm hungry and exhausted and i really just want to know what to do?
are any of you who have experience in this department willing to give me some advice? i can't talk to my family, most of them are in an incurable state. the wound is still very fresh.
by fellowniusmonk on 1/18/22, 11:12 PM
My mother died first, she was young, she had successfully fought cancer for 7 years.
I was very calm, people cried around me, my one brothers wife was nearly hysterical at times, I handled funeral arrangements and my dad was just kind of floating absently through everything, distant at times, crying at times.
I gave my mothers eulogy, she was a great person, nearly a thousand people came her funeral. She worked heavily with special needs children and was giving, amazing and genuine.
I had nightmares almost every night for a year.
They were awful.
I was never particularly emotional or weepy around others, I don't think I wept at all during that year of nightmares, I did the things that needed to be done and only wept occasionally afterwards.
People process grief in different ways, I had moments where I reflected similarly to you about my lack of emotion...
The more years went by the more I missed her, situations or events would arise and I would almost physically crave her presence and opinions... her person.
It was all there the whole time, losing her was devastating in spiritual, emotional and practical ways for myself and my family, people just respond differently to these kinds of things, there is no one right way and people who demand a certain types of expression of grief... well I've found they often, strangely, lack empathy.
For some people emotions run very deep but don't obviously surface (even internally.)
You will feel grief as it comes, no need to suppress, drum up or prematurely meta cognate about it. The waves will come to shore and you should let them when they do.
by meristohm on 1/18/22, 10:41 PM
My dad drank himself to death a few years ago (well, over a lifetime) and after about a year The guilt of not reaching out to him more often finally faded. I mostly actively remember the good now, while acknowledging all the trauma.
If you don’t already have a mental-health counselor (disinterested third-party, a “helper” in Fred Rogers terminology) I recommend it, at least to offload all your thoughts and feelings so you don’t trouble your family or friends who can’t handle it or would rather not (as others have noted in other discussions, some people have family and friends who will gladly listen and support—-good for them! I’m not so lucky, as much of my family is also dealing with a lot of trauma and I’d rather have professional, not-entangled advice). You’re not alone.
by themodelplumber on 1/18/22, 9:01 PM
IMO the response you described is totally normal and likely the best fit for your personal psychology, especially if you have a personal history of similar responses to trauma. Your body-mind system is going to respond in its own way, and it really doesn't care about any other grieving stereotypes.
You can tell others--"look, I'm not OK, but I also know I have to process this my way. And I may need to process things at a much deeper level at first, a level of complex meanings that just don't easily reflect on the outside."
In the meantime I hope you will do the best you can for your personal care on an hour-by-hour basis. Feeding yourself properly, changing your clothes every day, making decisions to be active, getting any help you may need, will all have to feel like you're forcing it to some degree. That's normal in the circumstances. But if neglected they can add up to some regrets eventually, so hopefully there's at least a way to start putting some of those daily building blocks back together for yourself.
Hang in there, use the reflection time to soak up the big picture implications for your future and bring all of that life-changing, learning energy forward if you can. Good luck.
by Jaruzel on 1/19/22, 10:10 AM
I do feel slightly sad that they've 'gone away' but in the same way as if they'd moved to the other side of the world, and thus I'd lost contact with them.
My point is, we all feel things differently. Accept that your process is is how 'you do it' and it's OK for that to be unlike the people around you.
---
[1] The only time I actually cried, was at a friends funeral, and at the end of the service we had the chance to walk up to the coffin and say a few private words to the deceased. When it was my turn, I barely managed to say anything before I totally lost it and broke down in tears. Took me by surprise to be honest - I don't know why it happened, and it's never happened since.
by FroshKiller on 1/18/22, 9:02 PM
I loved them both immensely, so it troubled me that I didn't seem more hurt. I felt very self-conscious when one of the people providing hospice care to my grandfather commented that I seemed to be taking things well.
After a few years, I realized I wasn't more broken up about their deaths because I had already made peace with the fact that people die before I lost them. People have different relationships with mortality. It's okay if you cry, and it's okay if you don't. It doesn't necessarily mean there's something wrong with you, and there is no right way to grieve.
Since you aren't broken by the pain right now, use that composure to provide comfort to your family.
by jascination on 1/18/22, 9:51 PM
When I found out I didn't cry, nor did I really feel anything. Just the absence of feeling. Oddly enough, when my cousin called to tell me, I hung up, told my partner (who was very sad), then I went outside and fixed the broken clothesline out back. My uncle was a very handy man, and I figured fixing something was a good homage to him.
I felt weird and guilty about not really having any emotions, but I genuinely didn't feel sad or really any different.
Then my family did a little memorial thing over Zoom (our country was in a hard lockdown). We each shared a bit about my uncle, and.... I fucking lost it. I've never cried in front of my family like that before. And then as quick as it came on, it left. Now when I think about him I do feel sad and I miss him; I think my lack of feeling was a bit of a defence mechanism, and I needed an appropriate venue to let it out.
A gentle suggestion: Maybe you're not feeling anything because you're making yourself and your (lack of) feelings the centre of this. Grieving isn't about feeling bad, it's about honouring the person you lost and your relationship with them. The end goal isn't to cry or feel awful, that's not some pinnacle you reach or checkbox you get to tick as "GRIEVING: DONE".
I'd try talking to a psychologist about it, and just have a good chat. Talk about how you're frustrated that you're not feeling sad or grieving, and how that's making you feel guilty. Talk about why you feel like you SHOULD feel heavy emotions, because this person meant so much to you. Then focus on the person, on the impact they had on you, on the things you love about them and the things you think they loved about you. Move the conversation to being about the person you lost, not your lack of emotion - realise that this isn't about you, it's about the person you lost and your relationship with them, which is gone now.
by enduser on 1/18/22, 10:43 PM
You might want to take some time alone to be with your experience and not need to process the experience and behavior of others.
With time you can adapt to what happened and reclaim your full experience. For now there is dullness and fatigue while your mind tries to hold together your old way of being.
It will get better—if you let it. You must learn to feel.
by KnobbleMcKnees on 1/18/22, 10:15 PM
The first time i felt these was often months, even years after their passing. And in moments of vulnerability they can cut quite deep.
The crying you do in the moment has very little to do with grief in my opinion. Grief isn't being upset at a sudden change in the status quo of your life, it's the ongoing losses that you deal with as you move on.
I can't remember any of my Grandfather's jokes now. I went years without thinking about them once. Now it bothers me whenever I think of him.
To quote Gordon Lightfoot, "the feeling is gone and I just can't get it back".
by poormystic on 1/19/22, 1:18 AM
by olegious on 1/18/22, 9:22 PM
by nitwit005 on 1/18/22, 10:38 PM
This was particularly true with my grandmother who slowly faded due to Alzheimer's. She was effectively gone for some time. I still got upset of course, but it was mostly when I was chatting with other family and recalling past events.
by PaulHoule on 1/18/22, 9:43 PM
I have been watching a lot of Chinese TV set in ancient times (e.g. Three Kingdoms) and it is interesting to see the expectations that tough men, warriors, are supposed to cry. If you go to a funeral and don’t cry in that culture that would have been a serious breach of expectations and I think your commitment to the norms would be questioned.
In the last six months I have been working on a personal transformation of sorts and one of the discoveries is the cultivation of sadness to defeat hostility. I was in a situation where I had to eliminate rage against any possible provocation and i would flood myself with sadness sometimes based on my own personal losses, sometimes from fantasy and if all else failed I would go to the war memorial and start reading names.
I could not find the practice talked about in the western literature but found Chinese people knew about it hundreds of years ago. It sounds beyond the pale but I am astonished at the effect my tears can have on people, how it gets me much better results than getting angry.
by geocrasher on 1/20/22, 6:52 AM
Then, one day, I lost it completely. My daughter (29) even thought she'd already grieved and that she was over it. I thought we were doing something wrong.
Nope.
We all grieve differently and your time will come when it will hit you so hard you won't know what to do . That will pass. Your family needs to understand that. Everyone goes through it differently. You'll get through it and so will they. But not all in the same fashion, and you'll all come out with a different set of scars.
Also, a friend gave me this and it helped me a lot. I hope it'll help you too. https://www.jw.org/en/library/magazines/awake-no3-2018-nov-d...
by rtkaratekid on 1/19/22, 1:23 AM
Recently there was a podcast episode made by some guys I follow that is one of the most real an raw conversations I’ve heard (other than my own) about death and grieving. It may or may not be helpful. I’ll quote the description and give a link.
“On November 19th Erin and Michael lost their 13-year old daughter, London, to a rare disease (HLH). It was an intense fight and escalated faster than anyone could cognitively understand. One of our practices is to be open and honest about our process, to discuss how we work influences how we live. This is the start of that conversation, of realizing your worst fear and stepping up to confront all that comes with grief, pain, loss, and love.”
https://www.nonprophet.media/podcast-nonprophet/ep-181-londo...
by jamram82 on 1/19/22, 12:02 AM
by dwmbt on 1/18/22, 11:44 PM
firstly, i want to say that i really appreciate your candor. for you all to share those personal stories with me, a stranger on the internet who lurks on a website, is very generous and appreciated.
secondly, much of the advice seems to center around the idea that there is nothing wrong with me; this is a strange and chaotic time for me, there is no by-the-book response. to quote user ss48: << "There is no 'normal' way to feel about a calamity because it is so out-of-place from everything else, and everybody copes differently and expresses it differently, at different times."
thank you. i believe this is what many of the lessons were also trying to get across. i don't know that i'll ever feel differently, but with some more time between the situation and me, i am starting to at least look at those feelings differently.
i hope in the coming years i can bounce back as you all have and return the favor to someone else.
by MandieD on 1/19/22, 6:23 AM
My best childhood friend invited me over one afternoon in the middle of that and with her, I let loose.
Even ten years later, seemingly random things will cause me to cry hysterically about her for a few minutes, but once I’ve cleaned up my tears and snotty nose (ugly crying!), I’m calm again. I’ve seen the term “Sudden Temporary Upwelling of Grief,” or STUG, to describe this. It helps me to have a strategy for dealing with these - at first, consciously developed for my common situations (work), now kind of in the back of my mind along with things like knowledge of where my office fire exits are.
You never really stop grieving for someone close; you just get used to the grief and learn to live with it like you would a serious injury that has mostly healed.
by stevenicr on 1/19/22, 4:59 AM
I like to put soft limits on the time - so it doesn't become a 96 hour marathon.
There are some interesting tips in a john gray book: Mars and Venus Starting Over: A Practical Guide for Finding Love Again after a Painful Breakup, Divorce, or the Loss of a Loved One by John Gray
I realized some time ago that football (and other sports) watch parties are one of the few ways in which American men are sanctioned to be able to yell, cry, dance around in joy and sadness, touch each other (high fives, hugs, whatever)
and I got a new appreciation for people engaging in that kind of sports fandom.
And I constantly wonder what other activities with have in our modern culture that allow this kind of expression for men and or women.
by somenewaccount1 on 1/19/22, 2:09 AM
by soueuls on 1/18/22, 9:29 PM
Did I hate my father? Absolutely not, but that’s what happened. Sometimes it’s not too logical, trust what’s inside your mind, you don’t need to break down to mourn.
by givemeethekeys on 1/18/22, 11:39 PM
All I can say is, don't leave anything off the table while they're alive. Do what you can for them, and let them know how important they are to you.
by rg111 on 1/19/22, 8:50 AM
Write about your feeling with no bars held. Even if you decide to burn the paper later. Write your heart out on paper with pen. Don't edit or filter it. Let it flow undeterred.
Sometimes grief strikes you in bouts. After 2-3 days you might feel all okay, like the grief has disappeared, and it doesn't affect you anymore. But it will strike again- in periods- again and again. It is only natural.
You should also know that- "everything will be okay" is a lie. You just learn to live with the changed reality.
Know that proximity to people who shared their company for prolonged periods of time is the key to get out of grief.
Do not avoid your grief. Embrace it and live with it.
by SenHeng on 1/19/22, 7:48 AM
For me, the release of anguish came right at the moment when the furnace was ignited and my uncle was cremated. It was a very brief but strong outburst of emotion.
It's been over 20 years so I can't say if I felt better or worst after that, or even if we're normal. Just that you're not alone.
Also, age doesn't make it easier. I've worked hard over the past few years to learn to smile 'naturally' and attempt to release emotions on the spot. Doing sports that come with emotional highs help. For me it was snowboarding.
by jimkleiber on 1/20/22, 12:25 AM
I think the loss of a loved one can bring so many different emotions and that we may put pressure on ourselves (and others on us) to feel certain emotions and not others, but emotions often come or don't, outside of our control.
I had a friend who lost his best friend unexpectedly, mid 30s, and he said to me a few days after that he had the urge to go dance but felt guilty that he would go dance at the place where he and his friend would go. I told him it's ok to feel excited to dance, it's ok to feel sad, it's ok to feel confused, ashamed, numb, relieved, and many more.
Sometimes certain emotions come for people immediately, sometimes later, sometimes not at all—and that's ok.
Regarding talking to your family, sometimes it can be hard when our emotions are in conflict with theirs. If I say I'm feeling sad but not broken and they're feeling broken, they may have a knee-jerk reaction to attack our worth, eg, "What's wrong with you, didn't you care about them?" So what I try to do is pre-empt it a bit by saying how I feel and also saying I don't know why I feel that way, and then also saying how I I imagine they might be feeling. Almost exactly how you stated it in this Ask HN above. They may still respond in some form of attack, which can be hard to prevent. The part about imagining how they may be feeling might help you realize that their knee-jerk reactions to you are probably coming from their current emotional state.
I'd be willing to chat about this with you more if you'd like, most of my work is leading how to respond to emotional attacks and respond with love. If you'd like to, please find my email in my bio and send me one.
You're more normal than you think you are. I'm really grateful you posted this and that I saw it. I hope this helps you feel a little more at ease with how you're feeling. You got this.
by garethgilson on 1/19/22, 5:29 AM
I read somewhere once that grief feels like a ball in a box with a button. At first, the ball is almost the same size as the box, it’s pushing the grief button all the time. Over time, the box gets bigger, but the ball will always be bouncing around, and no matter how big the box gets, every once in a while it’ll hit the button and you’ll feel it.
Add to that something Craig Ferguson said talking to Bob Saget about their fathers passing: “It’s my grief and I’ll deal with it my way.”
If you’re feeling still and empty, then, yes, that is normal. It’s your grief, and you have the right to deal with it your way. Be the rock for your family, order takeout when you’re hungry, lie down and close your eyes when you need a minute.
I wish you all the best.
by andrei_says_ on 1/19/22, 7:57 AM
The heart takes time. The mind is as fast as a lightning, but often gets in loops.
The heart moves at its own speed, often glacial from the mind’s perspective. But it’s moving. The crying, the grieving, the heavy emotions are the heart digesting the loss.
If you can, find someone to talk to about this. As often as you need to. A friend you can cry in front. Someone who doesn’t judge you and can hold space for you without trying to console or change you.
You may find yourself going over the same territory, as if in circles. But it’s likely a spiral and not circles. Allow yourself the time to heal.
If you feel stuck and start getting depressed, seek help.
by moralestapia on 1/19/22, 12:23 AM
Also, keep an eye on your (physical) health.
by mindslight on 1/18/22, 11:42 PM
As this person meant something to you, you do indeed have a loss. You are processing this loss in your own way, which you will come to see in time. You do not need to worry about what others think of your reaction.
My one suggestion is to go through the activities of the mourning ceremonies even if they feel somehow trite or inapplicable. You may be surprised.
by focus2020 on 1/18/22, 9:46 PM
by anoxor on 1/19/22, 1:29 AM
I cannot recommend it highly enough!!! The writer is a grief researcher and counselor who lost his adopted son to an overdose. The counseling wisdom along with stories from every angle and type of grief are amazing.
Get this book if you could ever use it!
From your post, people grief at massively different rates and processes. Unfortunately, grievers will often take another person's grief or thier own grief as wrong because it looks so different.
by Shared404 on 1/19/22, 5:37 AM
You may feel like you should suffer more, or wish you could suffer less at different points in time.
In particular, your situation sounds to me like you've shut down that portion of your experience, until such time as you can take the chance to process - at least, your description matches my experience of doing that. Don't let anyone make you feel bad, you have your grief, and will process it your way.
If you want to talk to someone, or more in detail my email is in my bio.
by ss48 on 1/18/22, 10:30 PM
It might help to hear others express the grief they experience because hearing what they are feeling or doing afterwards might help give you some ideas of what to do next or think about this person who passed differently. I don't think they would feel that you have an obligation to express grief to them when you talk to them because not everyone grieves by expressing it or has a way to express it. At the very least, you know how much you loved this person who is now gone, and that much can always be conveyed, not just by how bad a feeling it is to have lost that person, but also by how positively and greatly you felt when you were around that person when he or she was with you.
Also, very sorry to hear about your loss.
by sparker72678 on 1/18/22, 10:29 PM
Like others will tell you, everyone grieves differently, and that applies to all aspects: timing, depth, breadth, mode — all of it.
There's no "right" way to grieve, and there's no "wrong" way to grieve.
It sounds like your own response is concerning to you, but it doesn't have to be.
In various crises in my own life I've followed a pattern that sounds similar to what you've described: I tend to hold my emotions at arms length, leaning heavily on my rational thinking to attempt to work through the immediate problem until the storm clears. I am usually very calm in the moment. That doesn't mean there no emotional response in the moment, but I tend to be a very slow burn on the emotional side.
What has helped me, and what I would encourage you to do, is find someone you can actually feel comfortable opening up to. Doesn't mean you need to dump everything all at once, but being able to have someone help walk through feelings over time can be tremendously helping in processing grief (and many other parts of life). If that's a friend, family member, or therapist, it's worth trying to find.
My guess is that eventually this acute crisis will pass, and the waves will find you. Having an outlet for that can be a lifesaver.
tl;dr — There's nothing wrong with you, but find someone to talk to so that you can work through the feelings when they arrive, which they will, in some way, at some time.
by kleer001 on 1/19/22, 12:54 AM
There's tons.
Don't be afraid of "cultural appropriation". We're all human. You're not hurting anyone by trying to ease your heart.
by magicjosh on 1/19/22, 5:45 AM
by gorjusborg on 1/19/22, 1:45 PM
by joshxyz on 1/19/22, 7:56 AM
by pvaldes on 1/19/22, 9:18 AM
by elmerfud on 1/18/22, 9:31 PM
I process grief very much in the same way that I think you do. I do not express a lot of outward emotions or outward crying but I do it through quiet contemplation.
Just so you can understand my direct experiences I've had grandparents and other elderly family pass but I've also had my son die. It was about 6 to 7 years ago now he was in his early twenties and was in a car accident and I was the only person in the hospital room at the time that he passed even though my entire family was there. My wife and oldest daughter very much had the outward displays of grief like you describe. They saw counseling and they went to various programs that help you deal with grief counseling and group sessions and it was all very helpful for them. It allowed them to process their grief in a way but I didn't avail myself to any of that and I don't think that my grief was any less than theirs or that I handled it in a worse way than theirs. I do think that they did perceive me as a bit cold but I have always been more emotionally distanced then they are to anything.
I also had my one of best friends pass away in my house. This was shortly before she was 30 years old she moved back from the other side of the country to stay with me for a while because she was having problems with addiction and so forth and I didn't realize how bad it was until I found her passed away in her bed of a heroin overdose. This was a very long time friend I knew her mother or sisters and some of her extended family and I processed the grief in much the same way.
Everyone's different and sometimes we can put on a show to act as if we fit in to try and make others feel comfortable. That works for certain things, works especially well in my job, but for this my advice would be don't do it. Your grief is yours process it how you need you don't need to put on a show at this time in your life to attempt to make others comfortable. If they're your friends or family and they truly care about you they will understand you and understand you are grieving in your own way and accept you for it just like you accept them.
by supperburg on 1/18/22, 11:53 PM