from Hacker News

Bosch Smart glasses: A tiny laser array paints images directly onto your retina

by deniscepko2 on 2/4/20, 3:26 PM with 265 comments

• by database_lost on 2/4/20, 4:08 PM

  Start of the article: "My priority at CES every year is to find futuristic new technology that I can get excited about. But even at a tech show as large as CES, this can be surprisingly difficult. If I’m very lucky [...]"

  End of the article: "Bosch covered our costs for attending CES 2020."

• by nradov on 2/4/20, 5:33 PM

  As an amateur runner and triathlete I really hope someone will integrate this technology into suitable smart sunglasses. I would pay $1000 today for such a product if it actually works. My GPS fitness tracker is a great tool but I hate having to constantly glance down at my wrist to check pace, distance, and heart rate. This is particularly annoying when executing a structured intervals workout based on specific target metrics.

  There are existing heads-up display products targeted at cyclists such as the Everysight Raptor and Garmin Varia Vision. However they aren't practical or comfortable for runners.

  Ideally I'd like the smart glasses to have the following features: ANT+ Extended Display profile. 6 hour battery life. Lightweight with even weight distribution (not all on one side). Prescription lens compatible.

• by sebringj on 2/4/20, 4:17 PM

  Social ticks such as frantically tapping the side of your head, will be normal when someone tries to "remember" your name. I thought it was weird when people were talking to themselves with bluetooth on or walking into a street sign when looking down at their phone...but it's just going to get stranger. I could easily imagine eye flickering or eye rolling when your brain OS is rebooting. These glasses and also the contact lenses in the works will make us forget having to worry about things we take for granted today just as your phones helped us forget peoples' phone numbers or care about knowing how to get somewhere as the new devices will be contextually aware of facts we need to know that will just appear as an overlay...no more "let me look it up on google". If it's coupled with audio, gps and other inputs, it could be even more proactive in finding things before you even knew you needed them.

• by magduf on 2/4/20, 5:40 PM

  This reminds me of a technology from a couple of decades ago that seemed to disappear: wearable computer monitors. What ever happened to those?

  Basically, you wore this thing like eyeglasses on your head, and it had a small arm that extended in front of your eye (but a little below it). When you looked down, it appeared like a computer monitor was hovering in front of you. The very early models were 320x200 resolution in monochrome (red on black), but I tried one at a trade show in 2000 that I think was 800x600 in VGA color, which at the time was pretty decent. I'm surprised these never got more popular; they would be great for laptop computers: you could have total privacy in your viewing (unlike a normal screen), and with improvements in the technology you could potentially "see" a much larger screen than a normal laptop has.

  Does anyone else remember these?

• by RcouF1uZ4gsC on 2/4/20, 6:05 PM

  What are the safety implications of this? If something goes wrong, will people be blinded? What effect do these lasers have long term on the retina, the lens, and the vitreous humor of the eye?

  I did not see any part of the article address these issues.

• by thdrdt on 2/4/20, 6:37 PM

  This could become big in logistics. For example for order picking.

  But also for maintenance crews. Want to know which machine broke down? The glasses will give you directions and will even give you an overview of the maintenance history.

  I believe this is not a consumer product. Bosch has some consumer products but they are way bigger in the business market.

  And about the laser: it's just light. A laser doesn't mean 'cut through everything'. It all depends on the power. I'm sure Bosch doesn't want to melt your retina.

• by andrewla on 2/4/20, 3:54 PM

  Maybe this will be the exception, but in general these seem so consumer focused as to be useless. I just want something that can accept some standardized or ad hoc well-documented protocol to do basic raster images or text or something as a baseline. I want something that application developers (and people like myself) can start to hack on and explore where it can go.

• by gshdg on 2/4/20, 4:05 PM

  I'm very curious what the effect would be over the course of decades of having even very weak lasers hitting your retina directly.

• by JackRabbitSlim on 2/4/20, 4:05 PM

  https://spectrum.ieee.org/biomedical/imaging/in-the-eye-of-t...

  IEEE's coverage way back in 2003 and even by then a prototype existed as far back as 91.

  I've been waiting for people to circle back around to this type of display for about a 2 decades now. I suspect the biggest barrier/reason is aversion to liability and safety of beaming lasers directly into customer eyes.

• by Darkphibre on 2/4/20, 5:57 PM

  OMG. I've been waiting for this tech ever since reading about this in high school during the early 90's, coming out of the HIT Lab research (Human Interfaces Technology Laboratory at University of Washington). http://www.hitl.washington.edu/projects/wlva/

  I was so enamored, I actually talked my mom into swinging buy when we did a Pacific Northwest drive during summer break. Unfortunately, the lab was closed to tours at the time. And the lab's name also tickled me. It was my aspiration to go work there, and on VR technologies... and then the media chewed up the tech and spit it out, causing the long winter (I also wanted to get into Neural Networks and AI...)

• by DanBC on 2/4/20, 3:37 PM

  This is a great article and it covers a lot of stuff that I'd wondered about before.

  Here's someone doing a (somewhat terrifying) DIY version: https://eclecti.cc/hardware/blinded-by-the-light-diy-retinal...

  Virtual Retinal Displays are a pretty old idea, first being demonstrated in 1991. They've been stuck in development for years, so it's good to see them getting some more attention.

  http://www.hitl.washington.edu/research/vrd/

• by giancarlostoro on 2/4/20, 5:06 PM

  I think this will be the next frontier for wearable tech. Smart watches are part of it, maybe even a smartwatch with some buttons that you can feel so you can control what you see in your AR glasses. At least until we see wearable contact lenses.

  The phone becomes the main device, but these peripherals will enhance your use of your phone. Imagine being able to look up words you might not know when having a conversation in live time. Or seeing where the bathroom is in any building.

  Edit: If you disagree at least tell me why.

• by maxehmookau on 2/4/20, 4:11 PM

  This sounds fascinating. I can't even load the page properly in Safari due to the stupid scroll hijacking around the ad.

• by baybal2 on 2/4/20, 8:38 PM

  Very impressive how far they went with MEMS scanners. That thing is a continuation of this: https://ae-bst.resource.bosch.com/media/_tech/media/product_...

• by NikolaeVarius on 2/4/20, 8:22 PM

  On a somewhat related note, Google Glass enterprise edition 2 is now "generally" available https://developers.googleblog.com/2020/02/glass-enterprise-e...

• by jp555 on 2/4/20, 6:32 PM

  Here's a concise 3min overview of all current AR tech and the continuum of product groups in the AR-VR (mixed reality) space.

  https://youtu.be/U1BVI2JcNPc

  This product would sit squarely in the "Smart Glasses" group.

• by ortusdux on 2/4/20, 3:39 PM

  Just in time for the snow crash TV show

• by castis on 2/4/20, 3:54 PM

  Seems like this technology, when developed further, could be the sort of thing that https://www.skully.com/ was trying with their original prototype, which was really exciting to me at the time.

• by sschueller on 2/4/20, 3:43 PM

  What does 150 Line pairs [1] for resolution mean?

  [1] https://www.bosch-sensortec.com/products/optical-microsystem...

• by dr_dshiv on 2/4/20, 5:47 PM

  So, with eye tracking, we could put these little laser things on a watch to give it. 20in screen?

• by felipemnoa on 2/4/20, 8:22 PM

  Reminds me of the anime called "Dennō_Coil" [1],[2]. The protagonists use glasses to join an AR world. Never thought I would actually see something like this in real life within my lifetime.

  If these glasses actually work we could be entering an AR revolution in the near future. Even if that future is still 20 years away that is still pretty close.

  [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODTvrQFtEOM

  [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denn%C5%8D_Coil

• by euske on 2/5/20, 12:52 AM

  This isn't new. QD Laser https://www.qdlaser.com/en/ has been making a similar technology for a while. I've tried their glasses at CSUN assistive technology conference in 2014 or something. Their target user was mostly low vision people, and the image was very clear. They also claimed that the technology is pretty safe for a long use. One problem that I found is that I have long eyelashes and it kinda blocks a part of the image, casting a shadow. But other than that, it looks a solid stuff.

• by cbsks on 2/4/20, 6:19 PM

  I was working with similar glasses at Microvision 10 years ago! https://web.archive.org/web/20100114084506/http://microvisio...

  I don't know why they didn't take off. I was an intern there for a few months. Every few weeks another engineer would quit, so maybe that had something to do with it. It was a good to experience working for a failing company. Now I know some warning signs!

• by evan_ on 2/4/20, 5:48 PM

  This sounds really cool and promising but this made me laugh:

  > The concept video doesn’t really do it justice—it looks great.

  (two paragraphs later)

  > The concept video is a quite accurate representation of how the glasses look when you’re using them.

• by irjustin on 2/4/20, 4:36 PM

  Hrmmmm would have been good to know about the cost covering bit in the beginning of the article - but I digress.

  I am extremely excited by the prospect of these or any glasses like system that can work well in a package that doesn't look like a bolted a computer to my head.

  That laser warning sticker feels weird seeing as how that is literally the whole point of the glasses, so I'll probably wait for a 2nd iteration just to be sure. But for me, these would win over a decent watch any day.

• by eximius on 2/4/20, 3:59 PM

  Very cool. I was super interested in Intel Vaunt and this is just an iterative improvement. I would buy a pair of these if they had a reasonably open API/firmware.

• by jpm_sd on 2/4/20, 5:18 PM

  This is a really odd article.

  Using this device sounds awful!

  >

  What I do want to talk about is how this entire system fundamentally screws with your brain in a way that I can barely understand, illustrated by seemingly straightforward questions of “how do I adjust the focus of the image” and “what if I want the image to seem closer or farther away from me?”

  [...]

  because the Smartglasses are using lasers to paint an AR image directly onto your retina, that image is always in focus. There are tiny muscles in our eyes that we use to focus on things, and no matter what those muscles are doing (whether they’re focused on something near or far), the AR image doesn’t get sharper or blurrier. It doesn’t change at all.

  Furthermore, since only one eye is seeing the image, there’s no way for your eyes to converge on that image to estimate how far in front of you it is. Being able to see something that appears to be out there in the world but that has zero depth cues isn’t a situation that our brains are good at dealing with, which causes some weird effects.

  >

  Oh wait, maybe it's not awful?

  >

  for the first 10 or so minutes of wearing the glasses, your brain will be spending a lot of time trying to figure out just what the heck is going on. But after that, it just works, and you stop thinking about it (or that’s how it went for me, anyway.) This is just an experience that you and your brain need to have together, and it’ll all make sense.

• by contingencies on 2/4/20, 11:56 PM

  This demo is so weak I think we need a new noun for this category of failed wearable tech / lifestyle technology demos. Can anyone think of a good candidate?

  wightbosch, n. failed futuristic product demonstration. Etymology from wight (poetic) ghost/deity + bosh (British) nonsense + Bosch (German technology firm)

• by bobloblaw45 on 2/4/20, 6:20 PM

  It would be pretty cool but then again magic leap looked pretty cool. I'll get hyped after they start shipping.

• by rhacker on 2/4/20, 5:24 PM

  Not for me, I'd rather have a camera to get input and an audible bot in my ear, no visual change in my face.

• by mrexroad on 2/4/20, 5:45 PM

  Reminds me of the “Virtual Retinal Display“ that Microvision was trying to create back in the late 90s.

• by kick on 2/4/20, 3:47 PM

  Is this a vector display? The way it's worded seems like it, but I can't tell.

• by ape4 on 2/4/20, 5:53 PM

  Even in the demo video, some stuff is easy with a phone like recipes or shopping list.

• by gumby on 2/4/20, 6:24 PM

  Despite this being essentially sponsored post, I’m glad someone has finally got this kind of thing working.

  This is the path that should ultimately be us infinite depth of field and true image injection. Super exciting!

• by riazrizvi on 2/4/20, 5:52 PM

  In one of the photos, the dude is wearing the glasses and smiling at the camera, it looks like there is a green reflection. Is that just a reflection on the glasses from ambient light, or can we see the text he is seeing?

• by momirlan on 2/4/20, 4:49 PM

  laser writing to retina sounds like an awful idea. at least change the marketing

• by kleiba on 2/4/20, 8:06 PM

  Laser into the eye sounds like a great idea. What could possibly go wrong?

• by JRKrause on 2/4/20, 3:43 PM

  I don't see how they can hope to overcome the alignment issue. This idea has been prototyped before, iirc carmack built a simple one during very early development of the Oculus.

• by anfractuosity on 2/4/20, 4:03 PM

  What's the holographic film for out of interest, is it for focussing somehow?

  (I'm kind of curious as to why the lasers can't directly hit the retina from the mirror array)

• by zmix on 2/4/20, 6:49 PM

  Oh yeah! That's exactly what I need after looking into a lightbulb (my computer monitor) for a many hours a day! Laser, right into the eye! ;-)

• by jcims on 2/4/20, 4:44 PM

  With how well they design user interfaces on their appliances, it’s little surprise they put battery life right in the middle of the field of view.

• by LOL_Arch_Linux on 2/4/20, 6:12 PM

  I'm not sure how much I'd trust a laser directly on my retina--at least not until it's been very well tested (on other people).

• by jbattle on 2/4/20, 3:58 PM

  Seems like very useful technology for fighter pilots or even race car drivers (maybe they already have something functionally similar)

• by rdl on 2/5/20, 12:32 AM

  I remember using MicroVision laser headmounts back in 1998. It's kind of shocking how slow commercialization of this has been.

• by johnchristopher on 2/4/20, 4:44 PM

  I really like that this system relies on one eye only. I have a very slight strabism and some VR/3D stuff are out of reach.

• by kragen on 2/4/20, 3:43 PM

  How many pixels do they have, and what's the refresh rate? Also the one he's wearing still looks kinda dorky.

• by adultSwim on 2/5/20, 5:19 AM

  Great to see development is continuing after Intel shut down the division that was developing this technology.

• by m3kw9 on 2/4/20, 9:41 PM

  Next: how to prevent screen burn in.

• by max_ on 2/4/20, 9:52 PM

  Can an interesting application of this be how it can be used to assist the partially blinded?

• by weld on 2/5/20, 3:37 AM

  The next evolution will be implanted direct optical nerve stimulation. Should I hold out?

• by Simulacra on 2/4/20, 3:46 PM

  Daemon operatives, take notice!

• by rusk on 2/4/20, 3:38 PM

  Finally!

  We've been talking about these in Sci-Fi for years.

  Surely the Jet Pack can't be far off now ...

• by ranie93 on 2/4/20, 6:26 PM

  Can't wait to get burned in "pixels" in my retina

• by ocdtrekkie on 2/4/20, 3:48 PM

  I am confused that it "paints images directly onto your retina" (presumably, shooting lasers at your eyeball, which sounds unhealthy) and yet the writer was able to take a picture of the image on the glass.

• by gimmeThaBeet on 2/4/20, 5:08 PM

  Oh boy, I love that headline: Bosch Gets Smartglasses Right With Tiny Eyeball Lasers. You know you're in the future when you start with the tiny eyeball lasers.

• by jotm on 2/4/20, 4:24 PM

  I really hope they're just connected to a smartphone as a display.

  Who thought it was a good idea to put a whole computer in glasses or smartwatches?

• by stazz1 on 2/5/20, 8:39 PM

  Hope those lenses are not reflective

• by EGreg on 2/4/20, 6:49 PM

  These lasers... are they dangerous, can they leave lasting scars on the retina through prolonged use?

  I would like some info on similar things.

• by ampdepolymerase on 2/4/20, 3:43 PM

  Isn't this the same technology as Focals by North?

• by 0xff00ffee on 2/4/20, 6:40 PM

  TBH, I've wanted this tech for DECADES ever since I saw Scientific American TV cover the "Cyborgs" at MIT in the early 90's, and then Google Glass (remember when everyone was selected based on their open idea submissions and thought they were getting FREE Google Glass, only to get the $1500 invoice?)

  Let's start the list of all the things that can go wrong with this!

  On the plus side, I wonder if they could measure the chromatic aberration and distortion of the reflected laser light and compute a correct lens prescription.

• by benignslime on 2/4/20, 3:48 PM

  This is similar to what Focals by North have been doing for a few years.

  https://www.bynorth.com/

  Turns out the article mentions them.

• by davidhyde on 2/4/20, 4:26 PM

  I stopped reading at "paints an image directly onto your retina". This device is basically a miniature DLP laser projector that projects light onto a fancy light gradient stuck to the glass. You are looking at a reflection, nothing is painting your eyeball.