from Hacker News

When Your 11-Year-Old Says No to a Smartphone

by lucasjans on 9/20/19, 5:00 AM with 131 comments

• by m-i-l on 9/20/19, 9:28 AM

  I read a report recently on predictions for Generation Alpha, i.e. the generation after Generation Z (in turn the generation after the Millennial Generation) very roughly born after 2010. One of the predictions was that they would be both "digital masters" but also "the new old fashioneds" that would be looking to break away from technology more, perhaps as a result of feeling neglected by parents constantly distracted by phones. Examples cited included children placing smartphones on lists of things they wish had never been invented, and the 7 year old in Germany who got 150 people to attend a march with banners like "Play with ME, not with your phones!" Although it is too early to make any predictions that are likely to be especially accurate, and I'm not even sure how widely accepted the Generation Alpha name even is, it is none-the-less interesting from a technology perspective. And perhaps not too surprising since generations often go in cycles, rejecting parts of what defined the preceding generations.

• by outime on 9/20/19, 7:01 AM

  This looks like a smart kid from the description given. It's possible that he spent a good time reading recent literature about the drawbacks and decided not to join the masses. Or he just thought twice before following everyone. Either way it's always refreshing to find very young people doing different stuff by themselves as it's specially tough not to follow the trends during that age.

  I also noticed that there's something different compared to when we were teens which we often forget and it's that there are devices (smartphones) which are used as extreme surveillance tools by some parents. It'd not be unreasonable to think that this only reason may make the devices much more unattractive to them.

  Edit: verb typo.

• by Traubenfuchs on 9/20/19, 8:02 AM

  There is a whole subreddit dedicated to probably made up behaviour of children like that.

  https://www.reddit.com/r/wokekids/top/?t=all

• by endymi0n on 9/20/19, 7:09 AM

  For my parents, having their own car was freedom, as their parents didn‘t have them when they were young.

  For me, the internet is the world I discovered for myself, first in the age of BBSes and an early WWW before any of FAANG were even born.

  For kids, how better to make a difference than having none of the consumer devices that everyone including their parents carries around.

  Kids need to make a difference, as we all did. It‘s in our genes and we better learn from them.

• by throwaway66920 on 9/20/19, 11:38 AM

  Seems like a banal humble brag about her kid. The author makes it pretty clear she is really into social media and projecting an image of her best self. She goes to quite an effort to make it clear her son is rejecting shallow values. Likely embellished.

  I didn’t want a phone as a kid. That doesn’t mean I didn’t spend tons of time on the computer instead.

  A kid not liking pop music or social media is probably extremely common. Heck a lot of 11 year olds aren’t emotionally developed in such a way that they really care about any music at all.

• by kmjg88nvf8 on 9/20/19, 8:19 AM

  "I mounted photo after photo of them on Facebook with overworked captions"

  "He didn’t like seeing pictures of him, or anyone else he knew, online."

  That explains it - but I don't think it is a good model to follow for protecting kids from the internet.

• by vigenutis on 9/20/19, 7:08 AM

  I wonder if her children's reluctance to embrace smartphones is completely caused by the way she uses hers? If so, maybe we will see more children rejecting them as the 18-25 range become parents. I think many of the people I know in that range would do the same things that she was doing.

• by reportgunner on 9/20/19, 8:02 AM

  Kid says this about phones:

  1. They’re infantilizing, a set of digital apron strings meant to attach you to your mother. (He was onto something there.)

  2. They compromise a boy’s resourcefulness because kids come to rely on the GPS instead of learning Scout skills.

  3. They make people trivial.

  That's one smart kid.

• by keiferski on 9/20/19, 8:41 AM

  As much as parents might find it irritating, it's actually a cool thing that almost all kids go through a rebellious phase.

  It's sort of a built-in societal balance mechanism; no matter how far one generation pushes a particular set of values or behaviors, you can expect the following generation to push back against it.

• by Phenix88be on 9/20/19, 8:07 AM

  Anyone else think this is fake ? I mean, 11 years old can have that level of thinking ? Or maybe I m missing something ?

• by hnarn on 9/20/19, 2:27 PM

  One take that I have heard repeatedly lately is that while our current "old generation" may be seen as the digital immigrants that are never quite embedded due to not growing up with the technology around them, and the somewhat younger but now adult generation may be seen as the digital natives that did, the next generation may very well be the one that looks back at the digital natives and (probably correctly) states that they were naive in their assessment of technological threat, the rise of "big data" and whatever other privacy concerns may arise from the way we treat, or rather don't care about, our personal data today.

  Without question most people today (myself included) upload their private photos and videos to "free" cloud services without a second thought of what these may be used for. Technologies like facial recognition, deep fakes etc. are only in their infancy, but it doesn't take much imagination to see the next generation launching a counter culture, partly because that's just what young people do, to later look back at the "digital natives" with the smug realization that they never saw any of it coming despite the signs being obvious.

  Parents today love to concern themselves with "screen time" and other pointless measurements of how "genuine" (read: how similar to their own) the childhood of their own kids is, but they couldn't care less about how their own bank accounts, personal photos and phone calls slowly are slipping into the semi-public domain.

  Maybe it's just my own penchant for cyberpunk talking, but I have a hard time seeing how the subcultures of the future won't turn against these "convenient" sacrifices that regular people make on a daily basis, using their own privacy as currency. Just ask any young person what they think about Facebook and you'll get the idea -- it's for old people.

• by IceDane on 9/21/19, 4:01 PM

  I can't help but find this article incredibly cringy.

  Firstly, while I can understand some background info, I don't feel like her entire digital biography is needed to tackle this subject. Second, I can't help but think that her kids are acting the way they do as a response to their mother's behavior.

  > They’d create formidable, indomitable avatars with vast powers and an absolute immunity to scams, trolls, and disinformation. Their avatars, one day, would heroically match wits with J.K. Rowling and Soledad O’Brien, or whatever luminaries would dominate Twitter in the future.

  Am I the only one who thinks this is strange? What parent wants their kids to be some ... internet celebrity on the worst platform in the world? Seems kind of sad to me.

  I have a feeling this woman is incessant and obsessed when it comes to technology and that her kids don't want to become their mother.

• by thiccly on 9/20/19, 7:03 AM

  Inspiring. Just when I was thinking our culture is "doomed" the young ones surprise me like this. Wish the best to the family.

• by sneeze-slayer on 9/20/19, 6:53 AM

  Very interesting article. Anecdotally, I know several of my friends who have downgraded their phones from various smartphones to a simple flip phone or even no phone at all.

  One of them introduced me to the Light Phone (https://www.thelightphone.com/) which seems like it is in a similar vein, even if it costs more than a 10 year old flip phone.

  I wonder if this trend away from the "always-on" status quo will continue in the future.

• by dr_dshiv on 9/20/19, 7:08 AM

  There are $40 smart watches for kids that have a sim card and no location tracking. Perfect. They Dick Tracey when they want. We can let them play on the streets of Amsterdam and just call when it is time to come home.

• by cik on 9/20/19, 4:30 PM

  I think it's brilliant, and applaud the child.

  IMHO people spend far too much time on their phones, and other devices. My devices are for work, they're rarely for play (yes, the occasional video game), but there's an intense reality that I now have real conversations with people - and they're much more authentic, even about their time.

  I meet people for meals, for drinks, for a walk. I find out about their lives, and share my own - as opposed to skulking them on InstaFaceTwitterGram. For me it works - for others it might not. Fair enough.

• by menssen on 9/20/19, 7:15 AM

  "Kid who has eschewed the internet gets exploited by mom for vogue.com clicks"

• by fergie on 9/20/19, 10:33 AM

  This is one of the most uplifting articles I have ever read. There is so much hope for the younger generation.

• by GuB-42 on 9/20/19, 11:22 PM

  There are a lot of comments about "smart kid".

  I am not convinced. Not saying he is a retard of course, but that his aversion for smartphones is not a positive trait.

  Smartphones are incredibly useful tools. Very empowering when used well. It is the abuse that is bad. Refusing to have one is admitting that you can't handle it. Better than being addicted, but not as good as reasonable use.

  Another aspect is cultural. All other kids grew with smartphones, they have a common experience of memes, apps, and whatever is popular. Part of that culture he will be lacking, and he may feel himself excluded from conversations, and maybe even considered a bit weird. Not a huge deal, but that's something to consider. And no, lacking "stupid" cultural references is never a good thing, no matter how inane you think these things are.

  That your kid doesn't want a smartphone when other kids do is not something I would consider alarming or even something that should be corrected. But it is not something worth bragging about IMHO. It is just a personality quirk.

• by Causality1 on 9/20/19, 2:15 PM

  A question I have that went unanswered is why the author would be hurt by being called a gamer.

• by mellosouls on 9/20/19, 9:27 AM

  Who else clicked on this thinking it would be some brat who wanted a higher end model?

  Nice surprise.

• by Paianni on 9/20/19, 12:22 PM

  When the iPhone came out is was supposed to be simpler to use then all the basic phones that came before it, I'm not sure that's still the case anymore.

• by hdfbdtbcdg on 9/20/19, 6:55 AM

  This mother seems very disrespectful of her son...

  Her children are not her chattel to do with as she sees fit they are human beings with thoughts and feelings of their own that need to be respected.

• by newnewpdro on 9/20/19, 6:56 AM

  Smart kids.

• by azangru on 9/20/19, 7:26 AM

  I cannot imagine how it can be a good idea to reject the internet. Avoid social media all you want, but choosing not to have a search engine, dictionaries, encyclopedias, maps and so on at your fingertips is just bonkers. Also, smartphone is great at being a digital watch with alarm clock, a audiobook reader, a radio set, etc. You can rebel against the mindless social media generation to your heart's content and still benefit greatly from this piece of technology.